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tv   Dateline London  BBC News  April 15, 2019 3:30am-4:00am BST

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by winning the masters title at augusta. it's the american's fifteenth major golfing title, his last was the us open eleven years ago. woods‘s victory sees him return from years of injuries and personal scandals. a powerful tornado‘s ripped through a small town in texas, leaving many people injured. welcome to bbc news, broadcasting to viewers in north america and around the globe. it damaged at least twenty buildings my name is lewis vaughanjones. our top stories: and left 4,000 people without power. there were no fatalities, one of sport's greatest but two children died elsewhere ever comebacks — in the state after a tree fell more than a decade after his last major victory — on their family car. tiger woods wins the masters. finland's social democratic party has declared a narrow victory in sunday's general election. my mom was here. she was there in ‘97 as well its leader, antti rinne, so i couldn't be more is set to become the country's first happy and more excited. i'm kind of at a loss left—wing prime minister in 20 years. his centre—left party won a0 for words, really. seats in parliament, one more than the far—right, anti—immigration finns party. a powerful tornado rips through the south east of the united states — now on bbc news, dateline london. destroying buildings and leaving many injured. finland's set to have its first centre left prime
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minister in twenty years — but there are also gains for the far right. and — the bbc learns more about the drone attack that caused hello and welcome to dateline london. i'm carrie gracie. this week, a whole six months for comedians to make brexit trick or treatjokes as the uk wins an eu extension until halloween. but who has a better plan on how to use the time? and benjamin netanyahu on the brink of a fifth term. will the israeli prime minister now annex parts of the west bank? my guests today, israel analyst jonathan sacerdoti, ian martin of the times, italian writer analisa piras, and abdel bari atwan, writer on arab affairs. welcome to you all.
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do not waste this time, said european council president donald tusk as the eu granted the uk a 6—month extension. but what constitutes time well spent in the context of brexit? ian, you first. let's look at a timeline for the next six months. i think we could usefully do that for everyone involved in brexit. so, for the next 10 days, mps have easter recess. now, are they going to use the time to reflect, as the prime minister suggested, or are they going to lie in a darkened room gorging on chocolate eggs? i think the latter, actually. i think that's what most people are going to do. anyone who has watched the farce of the last few months unfold, which has been like, as a friend of mine in america said because we can't have a third series of fawlty towers, this is the next best thing, this british farce. people in westminster are tired and stressed on both sides.
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and when people are tired and stressed, they do not necessarily make smart decisions. so a break is welcome, but when they come back, things will intensify quickly. there will be another attempt to try to get theresa may's deal over the line. it seems unlikely, not totally implausible, but unlikely that that will succeed. the six month limit is actually really rather clever by the european union. it is not so far away that the brits or the british political establishment can forget about it for eight, nine, ten months. it is close enough that minds do have to be concentrated, either in the next month or so, or in september, october. and remember, the crucial thing that is happening
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is you have the european elections. this is about much more thanjust britain. there are going to be a fascinating set of elections across europe, then the selection of a new european commission, president of the european commission, a whole new power structure and political dispensation in brussels and that, those people will then be negotiating with the brits again in september, october. we'll come back to that at the latter end of the timeline in a moment. jonathan, just on those cross—party talks you are alluding to there. that is in the prime minister's diary. it's in the opposition leader's diary for the next few weeks. how much time will that take up, do you think? one would like to be a fly on the well in some of those meetings. i mean, we heard one of her own mps asking theresa may, when she was announced those discussions, between herself and jeremy corbyn why one week she was totally against him as a threat to national security and then asked what is the greater risk? she said this was all about balance and risk. why on earth would she try to usher in an era of government potentially, by what her own mp called a marxist anti—semite led labour party. i think she is going to continue to struggle with that.
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i do not see those talks going anywhere. what she is doing in those talks is allowing the whole thing to spin out longer and longer, knowing they won't come to an agreement, or if they do it and agreement that will destroy not only her own party, but the morale of 17.4 million people who voted to leave the eu. just on the timeline, how much of the next six months do you think that spin process, that you called it, will take? personally, i can't see it going on for much more than another week or two because i think this is going to be another technique that is going to fail for her. she will try and push through her deal again and will keep flogging that dead horse. she could potentially keep flogging the dead horse of discussions with jeremy corbyn as well, but it is so damaging to her that i cannot see her keeping that going. analisa, do you think those cross—party talks are going anywhere? i think so if common sense prevails. britain has become a farce, it has burned an international reputation for intelligence
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and pragmatism. and do what normal governments do, define a compromise between the physician and the government, a compromise is possible. so will they show pragmatism and intelligence? i think they have to. i do not think there is any more time to kick the can down the road, because the time for that has gone. so they need to find a compromise, a compromise is possible. if you look at the situation they could find a deal for which they accept, they would draw agreement from theresa may with a condition that the labour party has already defined to already put it back to their people. that would be a way to reconcile the country, stop this confrontation which has been damaging for everybody and find a solution that would possibly avoid the folly of going to the election of the european parliament
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when the country wants to get out. i am surprised, ian is talking that we could have a new european parliament. we could have a change of the hierarchy of the eu. we could have a new president, new staff. but are we going to have also the same theresa may by the 31st of october, for example? are we going to see changes in this country? are we going to see a change in the parliament itself, a different parliament? 0n the question of change of leadership, are you arguing the government should change its leader before it involves itself further in the process that analisa described as necessary, those cross—party compromise talks? yes. i believe theresa may failed to control her government, to control her party,
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to influence the country. failed also to deal with the parliament. she was rejected on her deal, rejected three times by the parliament. now she is talking to the opposition which is very late. if she cannot convince her party, if she cannot convince our parliament, if she cannot convince our government of any sort of ideal, do you think she will convince the opposition? i am absolutely... let me take that up. there are voices in her own party that says she has abjectly surrendered, it is time for a new leader. what do you think? i have been arguing for almost two years that theresa may should be replaced. britain is attempting to do something very difficult without a properly functioning prime minister, someone who can persuade, cajole. i have doubts about her deal but i think her deal is the best way forward, out is going to involve her deal as a basis of an exit.
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but she has failed to persuade her own party. i think she will... i think she will face lots of pressure to go but she seems determined at westminster and whitehall this week, certainly that was the gossip, that she is determined to stay. the cabinet in the uk doesn't seem strong enough to force her out. her view is that she wants to stay until the withdrawal agreement is done and just hopes that at some point in the next couple of months everyone in britain is so worn down by it that the deal or a tweaked version of the deal with some changes that labour approve of gets britain out. martin we have a local election soon. predictions saying that conservative party will do badly in the election. i think she is like a cat with a seven lives, to be honest.
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i hope she is running out of these lives! that is the other thing. the sense that brexit might be lost. i voted for it and want to leave the european union. but if the conservative party fails to deliver brexit, the conservative party is broken. if the conservative party is broken in a largely 2—party system, that means that labour wins and labour is controlled byjeremy corbyn. so people are quite... across the spectrum, people are quite chastened by that. i wonder if that won't, post—easter, that might force people to reconsider their position and for diehards to vote for the deal. 0n coming back to our timeline, jonathan, we have the local elections and then we have the european elections, me 23rd. elections, may 23rd.
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on friday we saw the brexit party launched with nigel farage. is that kind of revolution in prospect at these elections? who knows? we have got to the point where to map out timelines is almost impossible. this farage party which is effectively what it is, is depressing. yes it is a sign that politics is broken. this is a phrase we hear politicians saying when the do not know what to do. but politics is broken does not stop it or fix it. the re—emergence of nigel farage, who i'm no particularfan of but who is possible the most successful politician of his time. he's managed to turn on its head, this idea of the uk being subservient to europe, he has brought about the referendum. he managed in large part for people
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to vote to leave the eu and now he is reappearing again because he feels the party he used to represent as racist, bigoted and disorganised. we have to see how much of that was his leadership, whether he encouraged it are tolerated. i do not think his party will be the saviour of politics in this country. it will be interesting to see what happens. and jacob rees—moog's sister coming up as the respectable voice of nigel farage. this certainly seems to be making their circus something of a 3—ring circus. i do not know what is going to happen, nobody knows. at the end of the day, that is the feeling of all of our politicians. they have led us to a circumstance where nobody at all, anyone knows what's happening when it is happening. and that makes planning one's life, whether it is taxation, what you own, selling your house, where to live, what nationality today identify with, makes it impossible.
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that makes it difficult for leavers and remainers. contingency planning, the prime minister has said she does not want to hold the european elections on may the 23rd. that means as we stand in mid april, people have got to plan contingency on an election that the prime minister does not want to have. we have a prolonged no deal cliff, it is prolonged by six months, but it is still there, business is saying. the elections cost a lot of money and to bring the first to that point with a country that wants to go out. to spend a lot of money in a country whose growth has come to an halt. there are serious problems, to hold this would be ridiculous. i think that is also another pressure on the political classes of britain, to show intelligence and pragmatism.
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a cross—party agreement must be found before that becomes a reality because then that would simply complicate things further. analisa, thank you. we are going to leave brexit there. we are going to leave it for next week as well. if mps can have a brexit recess and so can we on dateline. barring major developments on the brexit story we will take a break next week from it. right now we are going to move on to israel and the middle east. in congratulating israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu last week, donald trump said his election victory promised good action on peace between israel and palestinians. does it? some of israel's staunch friends in us politics warn that mr netanyahu's campaign pledge to annex parts of the west bank will lead to greater conflict. jonathan, i am going to go to you first. some of our viewers may not have followed the israeli election closely, they may not have
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followed the result closely. can you give us a thumbnail of where it lives as? can you give us a thumbnail of where it lives us? the prime minister benjamin netanyahu is now is entering another term of office when there was an extremely strong effort to get rid of him. that was an effort led by a little group of well respected army leaders and politicians who grip together with the sole purpose of getting rid of him. going back to the trump peace deal proposal which nobody has seen except perhaps benjamin netanyahu. we know that in benjamin netanyahu, why did they vote for this man who is up against corruption charges during the term of office he is going to enter? the country is sick of in many ways, it is unusual to enter your 13th year of office. why did israelis vote for him again?
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they see in him a man who has stood up to the us president as he did trump hasn't his council. he stood up trump hasn't his council. he stood up to trump when he spoke in congress on trump ‘s doorstep. sorry, on 0bama ‘s doorstep. he stripped us presidents who seem good for israel. he has shown he is a great friend of the current us president. should there be a prospect for peace in the trump deal, he will be able to work with the president to bring that about. whatever is in the sealed envelope of the trump, he has reduced the number of rockets and terror attacks on the whole. he's kept them alive, his made
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relations with arab states in the area under the radar. he also knows how to deal with us presidents for the good of the country. perhaps he is their man. that is partly because the left has lost its way in israel. they did not in this campaign represent their best policies. they had their vote stolen by the blue—and—white party, the new party that did not exist last year. which was really a coalition of famous figures to get rid of benjamin netanyahu. something they failed to do. they did manage to decimate the left and steal away votes from the labour party. now down to a handful of seats in the knesset, utterly disastrous for them. shifting uneasily and a couple of the things thatjonathan was saying, where does this election result leave palestinians and indeed response from the arab world wider? first when donald trump, the leader of the biggest power
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on earth is working for you as your campaign director, when actually you are supported by the extremist right—wing population, i think it is easy to win this election. i believe benjamin netanyahu is more dangerous to israelis themselves than palestinians. to be honest. he is now going to destroy the image of israel as the only democracy in the middle east to an apartheid state. what do you mean? when he endorsed and he said he will implement the nation state which consider israel as a state of the jews only. anybody who is not a jew
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wouldn't have estate. it justifies israel as a itjustifies israel as a state of dues but it doesn't absolutely say that other minorities... that's what he said. it is documented. he said israel is a state of the jews. non—jews are not actually citizens of this state. it is written. sorry, it is nonsense. is the economist lying? he never said that. shall wejust accept that there are non—jewish citizens of the state of israel? there are 20% of the population of israel. he has voted in... crosstalk. without the occupied west bank, all the gaza strip, 20% of its citizens are palestinian arabs, christians and muslims. he has not said they are not citizens. of course he hasn't.
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crosstalk. he said that and i can prove it to you now. i will show you what he said exactly. second thing, he is going to annex the west bank. this is something that we... can check that we can agree, we cannot agree on that on the assertion that those citizens of the state of israel who are not jews... we cannot agree a mean, jonathan is not agreeing that he says... he is not agreeing. but it is documented. what we can agree on is that benjamin neta nyahu has pledged to annex... parts of the west bank. what he said during the election campaign and i urge most people to take with a pinch of salt what politicians say two days before an election, he said that he would like to impose jewish law in the jewish settlements. which have always, in every peace
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plan, been assumed to remain under israeli rule, whether or not they have been returned for land swaps. he would not justify the forced removal of those towns are people. that is very controversial because it upsets people who want to see a like for like land swap, certain borders that they want. we are talking about effectively 2% of the west bank area where jews live. that will potentially, he will be forced to compromise on that, he will be given that by trump, we don't know. for rather a long time, including with trump, the palestinian authority has refused to discuss with the white house what they would like. they have said no. the palestinians are possibly the only national independence party that have said no to their own state. jonathan, if you can stop there.
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i want to hear that what the palestinian responses and what the arab world responses to the of the election of benjamin netanyahu. first, this nation state law, it is written and it is they are and it is documented. we are not going to argue that. second thing, benjamin netanyahu is going to annex the west bank. what it means four major areas of the west bank which is... it means that the death of the two state solution. there would not be any state for the palestinian. it is recognised this solution. neta nyahu is saying i don't want this. what are the palestinians going to do about it? what are parts of the arab world going to do about it? the palestinians, they do not
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have nuclear warheads like benjamin netanyahu and israel. second, they do not have the fourth biggest army on earth. they do not have the support of the international community, the united states, the biggest super power on earth. so what you expect the palestinians to do? they should be helped by the international community, by the europeans, by the americans, to say to the israelis, enough is enough. you are killing a two state solution which is recognised by everybody on earth. you are establishing an apartheid state in israel! what is being done by the arab region at the moment? benjamin netanyahu was well received. oman is two million and the arabs, 400 million. we cannot see that he is winning
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the arabs onto his side. now there is a huge change in the arab world. there is revolution, popular revolution in algeria, popular revolution in sudan and other places. the middle east is changing. now, netanyahu is re—creating, re—establishing re—encouraging radicalisation in the arab world. this is the danger. we don't usually agree on these questions but i think that the election result, which has actually had very little attention outside the region, really because it wasn't a story that the western media was hoping for or expecting which was that benjamin netanyahu having his career ended. but i think his victory is a tragedy and a potential geo—strategic catastrophe because the attempt to unseat him was a manifestation
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of another israel, the other israel which can through its military and civil society, can see that the benjamin netanyahu's die—hard approach is leading israel to a very dangerous place. i think there is a case for saying that the trump plan, can then broker deals elsewhere in the region. but i think people will be disappointed. it is a deal hatched together by the american ambassador to israel and donald trump's son—in—law. it will create a backlash which will have serious consequences indeed. can i bring analisa in? it would be helpful for our viewers to have a look at the political situation which is a worry and a concern. we are talking about a prime minister who is going to be indicted in the next few months.
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we have heard that the international community must do something. we have heard a bit about a trump plan. a few words on what the eu, which has traditionally played a traditional role in the middle east. what can europe do, is there a role for europe? is it doing anything? the european union for 25 years has supported the peace accord which would create a two state solution. it has been suffering a setback when trump recognised jerusalem as the new capital. the eu has pushed for a diplomatic solution. that was a controversial solution. at the moment the european union is in a fragile situation, also because of brexit. what we are witnessing is the biggest defender of the two state solution in israel, palestine, is very weak and very determined but unable to do anything.
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there, i'm afraid, everybody, we will have to leave it. this is something we will come back to in the next months and weeks. that's it for dateline london for this week — we're back next week at the same time. goodbye. after a fairly chilly weekend with temperatures below average things will be warming up. this was the scene as a will be warming up. this was the scene as a sunset on will be warming up. this was the scene as a sunset on sunday. clear skies around there, through the week, there will be some decent spells of sunshine and this temperatures will be on the up. we start the day on that chilly note
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that there will be plenty of sunshine to much of the uk, claudia skies in the west patchy rain for the far south—west of england, a little bit claudia brandy's coast of england and eastern scotland. temperatures 13 or 1a degrees in the warmer spots, still rather chilly. we'll have more cloud overnight into the early hours of tuesday, won't be cold, it would be frosty but temperatures holding up around six 01’ temperatures holding up around six or seven degrees. tuesday brings rain in the west into wales, sunny spells developing elsewhere and temperatures on the up. up to around 00:28:36,530 --> 2147483051:51:04,623 15 degrees and the warmer spots, 2147483051:51:04,623 --> 4294966103:13:29,430 goodbye.
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